According to the Flocking the Sheep book, they won't be disfellowshipped but will be considered to have disassociated themselves, a distinction without a difference. Same announcement ("So-and-so is no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses") and same treatment from the faithful (shunning). Of course, some will assume they have joined some sex orgy club, or worse, but the elders are not supposed to comment further, even to clear up scandalous rumors.
under the radar
JoinedPosts by under the radar
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Openly converting to another religion but not disfellowshipped
by R Franz Ferdinand III inodd.... friends of mine recently became members of an evangelical church.. up until they got baptised in this church, they still were visiting the jw meetings on a regular basis.they weren't really fading in the true sense of the word.. they came out of the closet about their new conviction quite publicly and even didn't shy away from getting in debate with the elders on biblical topics.. the elders are obviously very aware about their position and as they still were attending the meetings not so long ago, they clearly can be considered as people associated with the jw organisation.. as far as i know it seems they won't get disfellowshipped.
as long my friends don't harrass fellow witnesses with their 'renegade ideas' and 'false religion', elders seem to comply and leave things as they are.. this puzzles me as defecting to babylon the great always has been one the most worst offenses a jw could possibly commit.. could this be a case of local elders interpreting/applying things their own way or is there a (new) general policy trending ?.
anyone who knows about similar cases ?.
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JW over-rode our Choice of Funeral music
by snugglebunny ina few years on and the funeral of my jw momma still galls me.
she left instructions for which kingdom songs to be sung and we gladly abided by her wishes.
the funeral was held in a public crematorium, not a kingdom hall.
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under the radar
Where does the "preacher" get off overriding the family's wishes? I wonder if there other JW family members who sided with the "preacher." Still presumptuous to do so, regardless.
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Help Me Regain Contact With My Still In Family
by pale.emperor insituation is, i'll never return to the wt.
my family with never leave the wt.. depending on who you ask you'll get the following answers when you ask about me:.
my family: he's confused.
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under the radar
If you allow your mother to spend time alone with your daughter, she WILL try to indoctrinate her, perhaps in small doses at first, and WILL paint you in a bad light. "Don't you wish Daddy (or Mommy) would come back to Jehovah so you all can live forever in Paradise and pet lions every day?"
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An Odd Request from Our Ex-JW Son
by TMS inmy wife and i, both out of the religion for nearly twenty years, live in the same border town as our 44 year old only son.
we have scant contact with our numerous jw relatives, although a handful of clever "double life" nieces and nephews socialize with our son.. we care for our six year old grandson weekdays while our single parent son makes a living.
we've been infinitely better grandparents than we were parents, primarily because of our exit from a high control cult, but also because of life experience.
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under the radar
I agree with all the above. A well-rounded education must include knowledge of (as distinct from belief in) the Bible, its major concepts, and at least some of its most referenced stories. I would argue the same applies to general knowledge of other subjects like the history of Islam, the Greek myths, the Roman Empire, etc. Things like this were taught as history, not theology, when I was in high school in the 70's. Other things like Roman numerals and cursive writing come in handy, too.
Your son is smart to make sure his son at least knows about other people's beliefs. And you are smart to present them in a matter-of-fact way without belittling the believers. The little fellow will figure out pretty quickly what makes sense and what doesn't. "Forbidden" knowledge has an appeal all its own, so the more informed your grandson is (age-appropriateness considered, of course), the better off he will be.
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(A Childhood Memory) THE MYSTERY OF THE LOCKED CABINET
by TerryWalstrom inthe mystery of the locked cabinet.
when i was about 10 years old, there was a tall, white handmade cabinet back in one of our storage sheds (a converted chicken house from back in the 30's, when my grandparents raised chickens in the great depression).
affixed to its door, there was a big padlock on the cabinet.
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under the radar
Fernando has it right, Terry. He just says it better than I ever could.
I really enjoy your stories. Keep 'em coming!
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(A Childhood Memory) THE MYSTERY OF THE LOCKED CABINET
by TerryWalstrom inthe mystery of the locked cabinet.
when i was about 10 years old, there was a tall, white handmade cabinet back in one of our storage sheds (a converted chicken house from back in the 30's, when my grandparents raised chickens in the great depression).
affixed to its door, there was a big padlock on the cabinet.
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under the radar
Another amazing story, Terry. Thank you so much for posting it.
That comment your granddad made about the Klan being "as good or as bad as the men in each chapter" hit home. I don't want to start a firestorm, but if one looks into the actual history of the Klan and its founding members without prejudice or preconceptions, it's clear that the organization's original purpose was soon perverted and it morphed into an excuse and a cover for all kinds of evil. Most of the original members, including founder Nathan Bedford Forrest, were horrified by this and formally disassociated and distanced themselves from it early on.
I do not claim to be an expert of Klan history, and I'm certainly no apologist for it. I have never had any personal contact with the Klan or any Klan member (that I know of). I only know of my late father's impression of the Klan, based entirely on his own experience of growing up in the deep South in the 1930's. He told me several times that he had never even heard of Klan members in his area harassing black people. He said they didn't "come out" very often, but when they did it was to deal with "white trash." This mainly meant wife-beaters and "sorry" white men who wouldn't support their families and drank up whatever money they could occasionally scrape together. My dad said it usually only took one "visit." The offender would be confronted by several fierce-looking men wearing their Klan robes, sometimes with torches and ropes in hand. He would be warned, "Don't make us come back!" On the rare occasions when a second visit was necessary, it usually involved a beating or a thrashing with a rope or whip. He said he never heard of anyone being killed, much less being strung up.
My dad was the most honest and straightforward man I've ever known, so I simply accept his statements at face value. By that I mean that I believe he believed what he said, but I cannot know whether his impressions were accurate or not, even considering only what the Klan did in that small rural area in that narrow time frame. After all, he could not have known everything they did. He could only know of the stories he heard, and how the Klan was generally viewed when and where he was growing up.
Another family story has it that one of my mother's brothers once saw what he thought were Klan robes among their father's (my maternal grandfather's) belongings in an old steamer trunk. My grandmother told him never to ask or tell anyone else about it. No one knows whether it was actually my grandfather's or possibly his father's. There are absolutely no family stories about that robe or anything else that could be remotely connected with Klan activities. My grandfather died when I was an infant, but I sure wish I could have asked him about that. Whatever stories there were have been lost to history.
Sometimes, I think there are family cupboards that are better left unopened.
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Terry tells his story of Billy Jack (Tom Laughlin)
by TerryWalstrom inhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ox2ypajugq.
sit a spell and listen to my story.. i once met a fella unlike any other.
let me tell you about the man--a strange and wonderful guy--one of a kind--but housing two personalities at the same time.here’s a quick list to capture your interest.. .
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under the radar
Another excellent story, Terry. Keep 'em coming!
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2014 master thesis about JWs LOYALITY
by fastJehu ininteresting (internet) finding ... after all the bunker videos on the 2016 rc.. this master thesis tries to comprehend the concept of loyalty within the jehovah’s witnesses movement.
what does ‘loyalty’ mean to jehovah’s witnesses?
https://openaccess.leidenuniv.nl/bitstream/handle/1887/32029/loyal%20to%20jehovah's%20good%20news%20-%20susanne%20kuipers.pdf.
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under the radar
I wonder if this thesis was originally written in English. It seems this may be an imperfect translation from another language (Dutch?). There are grammar and spelling errors as well as odd word usages and unusual phrasings. Even speaking strictly from an editorial standpoint, I don't consider this to be Master's Thesis-level work.
That aside, the reasoning is demonstrably non-objective. As someone else mentioned, it seems like the author secretly, perhaps subliminally, wants to be a JW apologist. I don't think she ever gets around to the crux of the matter: that JW's equate loyalty to the organization with loyalty to God. Even worse, they seek to define loyalty as unquestioning obedience. The two terms do not mean the same thing, and are not truly interchangeable.
This thesis would be greatly improved if it contrasted what the Society says about its not breaking up families on its website and what its followers are actually taught at the 2016 loyalty-themed conventions going on right now. There is a shocking difference, and the examples they hold up as the "right" thing to do in certain circumstances are appalling. This blatant, or should I say brazen, institutionalized hypocrisy should be exposed as widely and as often as possible.
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"Well now at least they get a ressurection!"
by stuckinarut2 inyes, that is what a witness said after the police shootings and terrible aftermath of violence occurred this week in the usa..... they said that it now gives them a chance to live forever...as if they would not have had that opportunity if they had not been tragically killed..... of course according to witness teachings, the contradictory thing is that if the big a had come a day before, then those same people would have been killed by jehovah because they were not his worshipers.....
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under the radar
That kind of thinking is dangerous! More than one JW apparently "went off the deep end" and reverted to this kind of deep seated cult-think and wound up murdering their own families to "make sure they got into the New World."
Some fading JW's have been told it would be better to take their kids out in the yard and shoot them than to leave the Truth™ and sentence them to everlasting death.
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Since My Mom's Death--not a JW in sight !
by minimus ini had one lovebombing when she died by the congregation and since then---- nada.
lol.
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under the radar
So sorry for your loss, minimus. I went through much the same after the deaths of both of my parents. I got a lot more comfort and condolences from my workmates than I did from my JW family.